It was a very, very big stigma that existed in Iran that we never knew about, that our family faced. All right. Welcome, everybody. I'm Charlie Stern. This is 914 Wired and my partners in this endeavor are Ardina Seward and Peter Moses. Welcome Ardina and Peter. And we've got some very special guests today. So this is going to be kind of a different 914 Wired. You know, this show is all about politics and education and culture. And we interview people on all kinds of topics, everything related to Westchester County in New York and how life is impacted in Westchester, a whole variety of different ways. We've interviewed authors and we've interviewed politicians, certainly tons of them, and we've interviewed all kinds of people. This is different, Peter, and Ardina, because today we're with Danielle Dardashti and Galeet Dardashti, and they have produced an unbelievable podcast series. It's a six episode podcast series, and I'm just going to put it right out there. The title of it is The Nightingale of Iran. Now, that didn't tell me what really. Exactly. What to expect when I heard about it, but then I checked it out. Danielle and and Galeet come from a musical family. They they they live in Westchester. You live in Westchester now, right? Danielle We're both. We both live in White Plains. Okay. Still living in Westchester, but there's something unusual about their backgrounds. Danielle and Galeet are from this musical family, happens to be Jewish. Their father is from Iran, and he came to the United States at the age of 19, if I'm not mistaken. Okay. And and so this six part podcast series is is a quest to kind of answer the question, Dad, why did you come over here and are there things that we need to understand about this background to understand who you are? It's a audio documentary about identity, belonging and music. So there's a geopolitical layer to it, there's a musical layer to it, and there's a family story there as well. So but also one of the major issues, I would think, is when people come from foreign countries, Jews come from foreign countries, they don't like to do this to explain the countries of their origin. They're usually very quiet about it. And what I was reading about, you, two of you, that you lived in a and a home where you weren't given a lot of answers. You didn't your family didn't talk about this. Hold on. Yeah, hold on, Peter. I needed to have one more important component to this story. This just. This isn't just any guy from Iran who came to the United States. Their dad, Fareed Dada, Ph.D., was a popular television star for about six months in the 1960s, I gather. And he was like a tremendous hit. I mean, I don't know if this is the exact analogy, but he was kind of like the Donny Osmond of his day in Iran. Danielle and Galeet, welcome to 914 Wired. How am I doing? You're doing you're doing good. Charlie. All right. I mean, so our grandfather was called the Nightingale of Iran. And our grandfather, the name of the show, The Nightingale of Iran. Our grandfather was a very famous singer in Iran for two decades. For the fifties and sixties in Iran, he sang at the Shah's Palace and in concert halls all over the country. And our father? Yes, for six months in 1961, 1962 was a teen idol on television then and then, right at the height of when our father became a teen idol, he left the country and came to America to go to college. And it's always been a mystery to really deny why he left, how he could have left at that moment in time when it was a golden age for Jews in Iran. And soon after our father left, our grandfather and the whole rest of our family left Iran also. So that was sort of the impetus for that, you know, created our desire to really look into this story. It's not that people didn't tell us about our family history. People told us about our family history a ton growing up. It's that the story didn't quite make a like make sense to us. We were like, Wow, they had this great life in Iran. They were both really famous and they had no qualms about leaving. They just left during like and so there were a lot of gaps and omissions in the story we felt, and we decided to go deeper and really find out what was going on there. Now you're the co-executive producers of this six part series, Danielle. You have a journalism background. You're the host, writer, director and senior producer. Galeet, you are the producer, subject matter expert, certainly musical director. And you each bring different things to it. When did you get together and say, We got to interview Mom and Dad, we got to get this thing organized? When did you then? You know, because a lot of people want to know about their family history. You have taken it to a whole nother level. Yeah. I mean, it didn't come it didn't come out of the blue. You know, I come from an academic background and I've been very interested in my family history for a long time and have explored musically my family background and have explored Persian music over the years. But, you know, coming together with Danielle, the two of us together asked different questions. And this really happened. Part of the impetus was that Danielle and I had more time to think about things because it was the pandemic and I wasn't traveling as much, I wasn't lecturing as much, I wasn't performing as much. And the same for Danielle and her work. Her work slowed down as well. And so we had time, the two of us, to talk about some of these things which which honestly we didn't realize we didn't know until we started doing interviews and started talking to people. We realized we realized that things didn't add up and didn't make sense at that point. And we at first thought we were making a documentary film. And as we as we started asking questions and as we saw as we saw that we had this treasure trove of of music and conversations, it became very clear that we had a podcast in our hands. Mm hmm. So the. Audio. Yeah, the already audio archive, it's like a it's, it's a gold mine that we found. And you, you ask Charles, and we know that this existed had we heard it before. So the thing is that the tapes are mainly so the tapes begin. The first tape that we found is from 1959 and they go all the way up until the time that people started having iPhones when they stopped recording on tape and it became digital. So really all the way from like 1959 up until the year 2000 are these tapes that were in our parents basement and from the sixties. These are these large reel to reel tapes that there was no way for anyone to play them for for decades. So they've been there in the basement and no one's like, I didn't even we didn't know they were there. No. Had known they were there. Nobody could listen to them. So those were we didn't know. Yeah, we didn't know that in the sixties. I mean we knew that our parents had a lot of crap in their basement, but we did not know at all at all or the all know what was down there. So what occurred to me listening to this is that there was a couple of things going on. It was a musical family. So. So along the way, it sort of made sense that somebody would have made recordings so that part. And so there's a lot of music to listen to. You know, Dad, your grandfather, they were recording artists. They were they were musicians. So that would make sense that along the way there were recordings. They spent time in radio and studios producing shows, but it is unusual to have a lot of the dialog that you have access to, and there's an unusual story behind that. Oh really? It isn't unusual among immigrant families from that time in the sixties. And the reason is that telephone long distance telephone calls were very expensive, flights were very expensive, and it is extremely common that families, their main way of having long conversations and filling each other in on what was going on in their lives like I should like to a very large degree were through tapes that they were, and sometimes they didn't even mail the tapes. It was like Uncle Yakov is going to Iran in three months. Let's make a deal it with him to take with him. So and it's interesting because since our podcast has come out, I have heard from numerous people who are, you know, all different nationalities, not necessarily Iranian, not necessarily Jewish, who have said our family did the same thing. I'm going to go search in my parents basement and attic and see if I can find these tapes. So it's I mean, it's crazy because, like, we know details about, like what colors our grandparents were painting their house in Iran in 1963 because because they're filling our father in. Our father was in college in America. So it's like it's really unbelievable to to get all of that information. But interesting enough, it's not that uncommon that it existed. It is uncommon that they didn't throw it away and that we found. Right. I have a question. How much of this you know, this music and this music and I. I take it that your dad's style was Mizrahi style, correct? Was it Mizrahi music? Not Missaukee. No. So our father was singing. So our grandfather was singing classical Iranian music on the radio. In Iran, it's it's art music. It's art music that is like the classic. It's not Jewish music. So when you sing. Mizrahi That's Jewish Middle Eastern music. Well. Mizrachi Mizrahi refers to Jews who came to the Middle East. I mean, came to Israel from the Middle East and North Africa. And this was pre Israel. So so they were performing already in Iran. They were singing either Persian classical music in the case of our grandfather on the radio or in in our dad's case, he was kind of singing international music in Iran, which was really popular already. A lot of sounds that that you would hear from all different countries. He was even singing Israeli songs in Iran. He was singing songs from Spain. You know, he he was singing international music that he liked in Iran. So really, just for the sake of illustrating this. Yeah. Just to go back and clarify that our DNA, they they're both Jewish, you know, men in Iran, but neither of them were singing Jewish music in a professional. Yeah. When we talk about them singing on TV and on the radio, it was mainstream. Mainstream. Their fans were mainly Muslims. But that came along. That came along later in the story with your father. If I can, I want to play maybe 25 seconds so that folks can get a sense of how the show flows and how the show is structured. Let me know. I should be able to hear this. But I keep on saying. He was a rising star and left it all behind. It never made sense to us, but that's because we were missing a critical piece of the puzzle. Galeet And I didn't understand what Jewish Iranians thought about Jewish musicians. We were gay. So there is a little clip for us there. Just a. Clip. Yes. Thank you. Well, that's just a sense of how you have woven together the musical recordings, the narration, your own narration, conversations from other recordings. And it goes on like this for five episodes, I gather episode number six, and the final episode is scheduled to be released tomorrow. And before we forget to mention this, you've got this tour planned, right, where you're going to be in White Plains on the 19th of March, and then you've got multiple dates and people can go to Nightingale or the Nightingale of a romcom. Just Nightingale of Iran, Nightingale of Iran, dot com. And we have a list of our events there. And our yes, our Westchester event is coming up next week on March 19th at Beetham Shalom Synagogue, which is our synagogue. There you go. So this is just my too intense amount of interest. Go ahead. Our Idina. Yeah. A quick question at that time and think little just listening to that short clip, he could have sang. He could have been singing right here in New York. I mean, there's not a lot to distinguish between the American chord style, if you will, and the Iranian chord style. So at that time. Well, that was that was a new York in English, an American song. He was. But I maybe I can clarify. Maybe I didn't say that properly, but his style I was expecting, you know, sort of a minor chord, more Middle Eastern, if you will, type of music. But it's not I mean, he's very distinct in his voice, in his chords, and in the way he sings. That style is is pretty. You know. Well, what you heard him singing right near there was just like an American American saw American pop song Not it not anything. It wasn't anything Persian. All right. But let me let me. Can I ask. Something from even the expressions? So, so, so. So the thing is how how how acceptable was his style in Iran at that time? Or was Iran in 1961 so international that the music style that he had was totally incorporated into the traditional Iranian culture? Okay. So our dad, who we were just listening to in that clip, he was singing songs that were not mostly in Persian, he was mostly singing songs. Like I said, from Israel, from the United States, from Mexico, Spanish national pre music. So, you know, that was popular. There were people who were doing that like Joan Baez right here in the United States. And and and Iran was very, very influenced by the Western world. And, you know, you have to remember, this was a different era where Iran saw itself very much in alignment with the West. And so in the meantime, our DNA, when the Shah of Iran, Reza Mohammad Reza Safadi Yes. No Pahlavi. Pahlavi Halevy followed. So with Charlie played that clip you were referencing something about what you didn't know about your family's view of Jewish musicians. What was the outcome from that? I think you need to listen to the serious, Peter, because that is a big, big turning point of the series. Actually, Charlie picked a really good spot because in episode two and three you learn a lot about It wasn't just our family's view of musicians. It was a very, very big stigma that existed in Iran that we never knew about, that our family faced. And yes, they were extremely, extremely popular with Muslims in Iran. But we had no idea about the the stigma that existed within the Jewish community about musicians. So you are you are a singer. And one of the things you do is that as you sing, do you sing with your father? Oh, well, I, I did have a period where I sang a little bit with my dad. He would kind of be a guest. And, you know, we grew up performing together as a family, all five of us. So as a kid, I performed together quite a bit with my father, my mother, my two sisters, but but mostly not with my dad. You know, just as an adult, that is, I performed a little bit with him as a guest. But we should mention that you have a new record album, which you can tell us what the title is, and my, my, I from what I'm able to glean though, I didn't hear it. You put together sort of a Natalie Cole type of thing on that album where you sing at the same time as he does off of previously recorded track, correct? Right. So that's my grandfather, not my father. And our our grandfather, who was one of the most famous singers of Persian classical music. He also he was he was Jewish, of course, and I found this recording of him singing the Jewish prayers of of which are these prayers that you sing before the Jewish New Year. They kind of get you in the mood for for this very kind of intense period. And it's so beautiful the way he sings. But it sounds exactly like the way he sings when he sings Persian classical music, when he sings in Persian, when he sings this Jewish music and I speak Hebrew. And so I could relate and I could connect to this Jewish music that he was singing. And so I wanted to connect with him. I didn't have a shared language. Daniel and I both did not have a shared language with our grandfather. We didn't you know, we didn't speak French, We didn't speak Persian, which were really the languages that he spoke. And so musically, I could connect with my grandfather in this way. And so I sampled him and was able to I was able to sing with him throughout the album and it was really, really exciting and moving project for me. And that album is called what. It's called Mona Just being Persian was not a part of our upbringing. It was like a side interest of our dads. It was like, if your dad is into some kind of sport and you, that's not part of your identity. It was something that our dad was, you know, interested in and interest of his, but not something that had to do with our family growing up. Our dad was really good at adapting and assimilating when he got to America and giving American Jewish audiences what they wanted, what they could relate to, you know, what they could relate to, which was Ashkenazi Jewish music. So he learned that, and he became an Ashkenazi cantor in America. Now going you you teach you taught at some point at a Jets, right? Yeah. The Jewish Theological Seminary. Yes. That's that's very Ashkenazi. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's where you learn how to become an Ashkenazi cantor and right. So of course, yeah. I mean, things have changed quite a bit, but not that much. But things have changed quite a bit since our father was there. I mean, they hired me somebody who who is really entrenched in educating people in Middle Eastern Jewish music and culture. But I was only there temporarily. And the Jewish Theological Seminary teaches and and also the Hebrew Hebrew Union College, the reform movement and the conservative movement that, you know, the biggest branches, they they teach cantorial music. That's Ashkenazi almost exclusively. And so if you are not from one of if you are not from an Ashkenazi tradition, you're going to be you're going to be learning a tradition that is not your own if you want to become a cantor. So that that was a very unique experience that my father had at the Jewish clarify. And I just want to clarify, when we say Ashkenazi, for any listeners who don't know, that's Eastern European, that's like the whitest type of Jew. And so we're talking about what Eastern and Western would include, also Western European. Yeah, yeah. My grandfather was a my grandfather was a German Jewish cantor. But I think that's what makes this story fascinating because no, knock it on Ashkenazi Jews. But we hear those stories day in and day out. We do. And that's our world. This is a different story. And that's what I meant when I said, Peter, in our DNA, this is something different because what Danielle and Goleta are doing is talking about how this family really bridged worlds. And maybe you didn't know that much about it growing up, but then you started asking questions, and I'm wondering when you thought about doing this, what was that conversation like? You had to have prepared your father at some point. Dad, I got to ask you about this stuff. Was there a point where he ever said, why the 20 questions? What is this? What's going. On? Why all of a sudden? Why all of a sudden they need to know why I left Iran when I was 19 years old, why I left Israel, why we did this and that and the other. He's been really amazing and open and been excited that we've been interested in interviewing him. That's fantastic. Do you think you wanted to talk about it? Is it possible he needed to get it off his chest, any of that? I don't know. I mean, he's he comes at it with real joy. Yeah. Yeah. It's great. And get it off my chest. Kind of pain sort of thing. Yeah. And honestly, I really I have never heard from him anything about. He doesn't talk about feeling marginalized. He was very excited to be able to be a cantor. I mean, I think for him it was just, wow, okay, I'm Jewish and this is how they do Judaism here in the United States. So I guess I'll learn this American version of Judaism. It's like somebody changing their accents, like when they move from the South in the United States to the north, because they feel pressured to do that. And they don't necessarily I mean, it's a very subtle and bizarre kind of marginalization. It happens within all kinds of different communities where there's pressure to become more like what the majority is, you know, And but our father doesn't talk about it like it was a bad thing. Even even now, he doesn't feel like it was a bad thing. It's that. Yeah, you mentioned that there's a third sister. Yeah, she involved in any of this journey with you too? She sure is. So our sister is a rabbi and she's the rabbi of Keene Street Synagogue in Brooklyn, and we are doing our first in-person event. Our big sort of like launch party is this Thursday in Brooklyn at Michelle's synagogue. And then our next in-person event is at our own synagogue here in White Plains at Beetham. But yeah. Which is on sale for anyone watching or bet on. Shalom is on Soundview Avenue near the corner of Old Mamaroneck Road. There's a large parking lot. That's enough parking for anyone who wants to. Come be registered for the event. I have to register Charlie on our date. If you want to go. I have to register here. I want. I want to learn more about it. That's right. You have to be registered for the event. But. But you'll find out in episode six of our series. Our sister is much younger than us, and she didn't have the exact same experience as us. She's ten years younger. Yeah, well, we like to. We like to break news here on 911. When is coming out is this coming up today? This will come out Wednesday. Wednesday. Okay. So I don't know how long this lasts for. We just found breaking news. Breaking news. You're like first to know Charlie's story. This happened right before we started this interview. We found out we got a text that we are listed under New and Noteworthy this week on Apple Podcasts. Now, I don't know, does that start on Monday and go through the following Sunday? I have no idea. But we are listed as like a featured podcast on Apple and I assume that's going to really drive a lot of traffic and work for you. There have been a lot of exciting things that have happened this week. You know. The term in the podcasting world, it's going to blow up, it's going to blow up because when that thing goes on, the suggested area of Apple, which is very hard to get on, you're going to get hundreds of downloads. So this will be this Charlie. It's a great show if anybody has listened to it, you know that. But we also have a really great team that we're working with. This was an effort the leading I have a great production team and a great team of a very scrappy small team of PR and marketing people who are working with us who are really amazing. And now you have a media partner called Jewish Telepathic sorry, Jewish Telegraphic Agency. Well, that would be my think. Yeah, that would be totally different. Now they could do both. Maybe they can do both and and and others. So we wish you all the luck in the world. It's a learning experience. And Daniele da Dashti, thank you for being our guests. You have asked your parents the hard questions that kids seldom ask What was going on before I was born. And in the process, you've uncovered a tremendous amount of history and knowledge and understanding and it's and music and it's a wonderful six part podcast. I recommend everybody go check it out. It's called The Nightingale of Iran. Nightingale of Iran Bcom. If you're not sure where to find it, just search for it. And you can certainly find it on on Apple Podcasts and you have answered the question, what is the MOT tribe stigma? That is something I never would have known about in a million years, and it's one of many of the sort of unlocking points of this of this podcast where you drive toward answering the question, why did you leave Iran? So with that, I'm going to thank you on behalf of our Dina Seward and Peter Moses and myself. Thank you for being our guest on 914 Wired. Thank you so much for having us.