Welcome back, everybody. This is Charlie Stern. You're watching 914 Wired and this is a video podcast where we talk about politics, education and culture and all things that impact life in Westchester County. My partners in this endeavor Ardina Seward and Peter Moses. Good morning, everybody. Good morning. Yes, good afternoon. You're right. It's been afternoon for a few hours. Thank you for the reminder, Peter. So what we're going to talk about today is a continuation of our discussion of what's going on in the village of Mamaroneck and what going on. And it's not going. On in the village and what's not happening in the village and in between. So we had a couple of folks on talking about their opposition to an affordable housing proposal. And but today, we've got two members of the Village Board of Mamaroneck, Lou Young and Leilani Yasar Reed. Both of you are return people on this show. So thank you very much for coming back on here again, Ardina. Why don't you take it from here? Yeah, well, first of all, I want I want to thank our guests for being on Lou, who I've known for decades. We used to work in the trenches together and fight in the trenches together, too. And we have Lani Iser, who is a resident of Mamaroneck. And I can't thank you guys enough for being on the show because we're talking about a very controversial topic. So we say, and I'm putting that mildly. You both of you are members of the trustees for the village of Mamaroneck, and both of you are for affordable housing. We are two people on this week who vigorously defended their position as mayor against it. So I guess, you know, Leilani, I will throw it out to you. Why are you supporting affordable housing for the village of Mamaroneck? I support it because I think that for many years the village has for I guess not years, but decades. The village of Mamaroneck has tried its best to provide different types of housing in Mamaroneck, but it's been a slow decline and that a lot of people who used to live in the village no longer can. Even myself. I left the village because I could in a year ago. After college, I left because I couldn't afford to live here. But I give things that I was able to come back in. I think it was 2016 or 2025, 2016 that I came back with my husband. But it's something that is needed. The cost of living has gone up and it's not matching with people's wages. So we have to figure out a way for people to be able to live and not live. I'm not saying they're living beyond their means, but living within their means and having a variety of housing that people could afford. It's important to all. And Lou, Lou, you and I have covered affordable housing topics in our previous careers for ages. So we've basically seen all sides of it. You are taking a position in favor of affordable housing because you are wearing a different hat now. So in terms of your new capacity as a village of Mamaroneck official, why are you defending it? Because we need it in basically the situation we have in the disconnect between the housing prices and the demand for housing and the availability of it is unprecedented. I'm unprecedented. That is a direct quote from our previous planner, Greg Cutler. And it's regionally unprecedented and it affects everybody. But, you know, if you have to be rich to move to any of these communities, that might be okay. If it's a community that is kind of a monochromatic or not very diverse because. Well, that's that's sort of their their base of sort of their their reason for being. And that's why they're there. It is what they are already. This community is diverse, has been diverse, and is losing its diversity because most of the people who aren't rich, who live here already could not possibly afford to move here if they wanted to do it today. So so it's driving people of of less than affluent means out. And if we don't address it, the community will change dramatically. And it's and it's it's not it's not a small emergency. It's a big emergency. Let me let me ask you a question. I brought this up last week and the two people who were on the show had never heard of this before. But there are programs across the country called workforce housing. Are you familiar with it? Yeah, because the guests last week were unfamiliar with it. Have you considered as the affordable option to put in work force housing so that teachers and police officers and firefighters could live within the communities that they serve? Well, I don't I mean, I'll ask well, I'll. Go ahead and I'll go after you. I'm thinking this. I mean, I think if you build it, they will come. These are not giveaway apartments. So they're not. Cheap to live in. Some of them were thousands of dollars a month and you have to have a job. And what kind of job does that kind of person make? And they will come. I don't think you have to necessarily gauge it through those specifics, but the people who will live in those apartments are people who have those kind of jobs and will work in the area. That's just the way it will be. It's not going to be somebody from from the Bronx who just decided they want to move here. I mean, they want to they'll want to live in Mamaroneck. They'll have a job. They'll you know, they'll be more likely to want to live here If they have a job here. They're not going to move here if they work in Queens. I mean, it just makes sense. And this idea that that you've got to restrict it somehow very, very locally that only local people can get in. That's code for a lot of things. You know. If you'll do I want to I want to pick up on that point. Okay. Real quick, because one individual so, you know, we had a just a for frame of reference here, if you're listening for the first time, we had a show last week where we talked to a couple of folks who are opposed to this this affordable housing proposal. And a lot of people watched it. And one of the people who watched it was a former mayor of America, guy named Tom Murphy, and he actually posted a comment, I want to read it. He said, I never promised anyone that the apartments would go, that the apartments would exclusively go to the Mamaroneck residents. That is what the opposition has been saying to discredit the project. So I think that's significant because it's possible for a small number of people, a vocal number of people to kind of say things that bias the broader view of the issue. And I think maybe that's some of what's going on here is underscored by the former mayor. Well, I know that what I what we witnessed and I don't want to discredit any person or take away their their feelings and their opinions about the affordable housing because what they feel it is and what it could be is their feelings are valid and their opinions are valid. But we've had people at meetings fought for affordable housing and opposed and people who would stand up and say, I know that these this housing is not guarantee to me. Mm hmm. And then you will hear in the next breath they're telling you that you're going to get it. And like nobody has said anything. So what I would have what I personally would appreciate is just when we when we do speak about something, is speaking based upon how you feel or what your opinion is not based upon what you think the general opinion is. And how do you think those facts get out of hand in the first place? How do you how does the cat get out of the back? Well, you kind of a break before we started recording about how the Internet has allowed us to, you know, just put out information and sometimes make it truth and sometimes. You mean misinformation and make it just. Information? It could be information, misinformation. But there's there oftentimes there could also be that a person nothing. That's that that's what the former mayor did. But if I sat there and said something in a meeting and then I have to backtrack because, okay, I was like, well, I did not mean and I apologize for what? For misstating something. So those that could be misinformation or you can find something on the Internet and that could have worked in another in another area, but it may not work for the village. There's a lot of it, just a lot of variables as to how information, misinformation could go out. But it's. Also good. On people's real strong opinions about something. And that's the that's the truth that they want to put out. And I mean, you know, look, I want to I want to get back to a point that you made earlier when you alluded to something called code. What what define code? We don't want like outsiders. I mean, it could be. Well, there's certainly a racial element to it. But what's the racial element. In the community? There is a a whole I've been here all my life. I don't like newcomers kind of thing. And don't tell me how to do things because I grew up here. I mean, there's I think that's fair, isn't it, Leilani? I don't necessarily think that is all that's all about racial, because that also could be about numbers. And there's there's a lot of there could be people who've been here for for a long time, whoever who can or who may have an issue with people or who are new coming in. So I don't know if that's solely based upon ethnicities of people coming in. But but but you get you get a longing for the good old days. Mm hmm. Make America great again. I'll tell you this. We did. And the previous mayor and myself, not Leilani so much. Probably because they were. They came in only this year. But we did a dreadful job of trying for this. For this project. We didn't. We didn't prepare them. We didn't anticipate the level of feedback, of pushback we were going to get. And the opponents weaponized that that natural anxiety and drove wedges into the into what is what is a very good proposal that's very positive for the community. And and and they you know they did a pretty good job of weaponizing anxiety over flooded. How could you work on affordable housing if you haven't fixed flooding which is like saying how could you work on a cure for cancer if you haven't solved world peace? I mean, it's it's it's it weaponizes people's natural anxiety and and it's is and we gave them the opening. We're guilty of that, but we have to fix it now. So it's a it's a recurring story. Lu, You know, you've been on this program talking about flood mitigation several times. There's a made there's a there was a big flood mitigation story in Pelham, and we had the Mayor of Pelham on here recently. And one of the interesting things he said echoes what you just said, which is it's possible for a small number of opponents to appear much larger than they really are. And how do you think that gets out of control? And what could you have done differently? I mean, you're you're bold and I appreciate your being forthright that there were things that weren't teed up perfectly if when these kinds of things are teed up right. How does it go? Can I ask, what does that look like? You know, let me ask you. Go ahead. Go ahead. Yes. No, no. No, no. I want to I want to hear a lot of your take on this. I think one of the things that we could have done, which we did later on, is send out a survey to the public asking about any questions that they may have about what is affordable housing, because if they did not know what affordable housing or housing that is affordable, the definition, if they had questions about that. And then also within that same survey was questions about the two proposals that came in. So if they just had questions, they can send them in. If we would have done that earlier, maybe, maybe not sure I would have survived, but maybe that would have alleviated some concern. We also could have pushed out more information throughout last year from I think when we started the conversation was in, I think March. We kind of started the conversation, but really little by little. Even us as a as a board and as a village putting out information about what affordable housing is. We could have done some preemptive work, but it's I am not sure if it would have helped or not helped because there the strong opposition has been the face, front camera, front, the loudest voice. And that's not to say that there's other people who do not have a voice. They just haven't necessarily been on camera or at our board meetings. We've heard from them. They sent in emails. They talked to us personally that are in favor, but they are not at our board meetings. And they've been that opinion. They've been intimidated as well. I mean, there's an intimidating factor here of somebody who gets up and speaks for this, gets catcalled from the audience. There are groups of people who hang outside the meetings, and there was there was incidents outside the meetings on two different occasions that the part, you know, response. It's the the the vitriol and the intensity of this tells you there's something else going on that it's not just about parking, it's not just about traffic. It's about something else. Okay. But you keep alluding to that. You know, I hate to belabor the point. You keep alluding to that. Something else. And I have a feeling that it's moving towards a direction of race and culture, if that's if that's what you're alluding to. So, you know, let's let's meet the dragon. If you're talking about if you're talking about at the heart of this is race and culture, then bring it on. Lou, Tell us what you mean. Well, there's an element there. I mean, there's a the discussions we've seen of glimpses of inside these closed Facebook groups, the the some of the comments that that are clearly racist based. You're not going to advertise it in the Bronx, are you? I mean, that kind of thing. Some of the comments we've we've gotten from some of our Hispanic citizens pointing at pictures of people who were outside the meeting saying that person said don't speak Spanish. That person said, go back to where you came from. There was tension there and the history. 2006, The Village was a national poster child for intolerance in dealing with day laborers. Everybody forgot about that. There were people on the board who called day laborers locusts. I mean that there there is a history there that is not pleasant and not not something to be simply wallpapered. Let alone that Mamaroneck School District last year just got there. The attorney general's statement or any general's report about the racism that was going on, and then Mamaroneck School District. So things overflow and it doesn't just start with our kids. So, you know, it's not that it's not there. And it would be really remiss if people, you know, kind of say that it's not there when it it it's there. It is there and it's been there. Well, my question is, since we know that's true, why are people so reticent to say it? You say what? Why are people so reticent? And, Lou, when you comment on this, it's a little couched. You know, our DNA had to draw it out a bit. Why can't you call racism? And I know that I'm not. I'm not I don't I don't think that's that's the answer. I don't think that. Would give you a chance. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. There is about this project and there are things. There are certainly things that need to be questioned about parking and density and. Absolutely right. Right. So simply because a new you know. I don't know. You can look to your left when you're when you're when you're in a fight and not like the person who's fighting with you. And I know there are people who got who have questions about this project who are really uncomfortable with the allies they have. I get that. And I don't want to dismiss their concerns. I don't understand. But. But, but, but. But those people are are front and center and are amplifying the vitriol. And and and that's that's a fact. You know, I don't know if you I don't know if you listen to the show or watch the show this week. But one of the one of the lines really resonated with me. And I think it also resonated with our Dina and Charles. One of the guests said, not here, not now. And my answer always is, if not here, where? If not now, when? They never have an answer for that. No, they. They don't seem to. Yeah. And also for me, the reason why that particular remark was so resonant was because it has echoes of integration. The 1960s. 246, eight. We don't want to integrate. It's that. It's that all over again. But you know something but let's let's not let's not make it into a black and white issue because to be fair to the people who oppose it, there are issues of parking. There are issues. You know, there are issues of flooding. And Lou, you are correct in me before I buy the statement that I made last week saying that it would overburden the school system. So let's decipher those issues. Also, besides the issue of racism, which frankly has been Mamaroneck and continues to be a. Lot of us, but none of us are saying none of us are saying that there are other issues that are part of the conversation. Right. We're saying that the rate that the racism part does need to be front and center along with the other issues. But it it has to be processed. Our DNA that has to be processed because we look at the issues we talk about on this show, education, housing, employment. Right. The issues of race. And they run through every single one of them. And until there's some kind of, you know, I guess what they called it in South Africa, truth and reconciliation, until there's something like that here, we're going to continue to to to choke on the spit of that problem indefinitely in everything we try to accomplish ever. But we can't allow it to overwhelm the discussion because the other components of the issue, in fairness to the people who are opposed and some of those components are you don't have enough places to park if you have a business downtown. Frankly, you're going to get PO'd. If you drive up and you and your potential diners can't find the place to park. So. Okay, Lonnie. The Lonnie was well, I didn't want to talk before. Let's go to. Go ahead. No, no, no. I think I think our DNA is correct. Like we can't over you know, race is a part and it's always going to be a part. And like you say, it's nothing new underneath the sun. I also believe that there is like there's this class system that is happening in terms of a person with a you know, with possibly low or can't afford anything. Like we don't want those type of people in that community. And I think that that's what's been said. But I'm just saying it's there's so many different factors. But then there are the other factors, which is like the parking, the flooding that we still do have to address. Now, when it comes down to the the overcrowding, the overcrowding in the schools and especially with our elementary school, which would be if we had two tiers built in an empty proposal was built in 100 year. Those students will, if their elementary will go to mass and mass, also hold a very special program, a very wonderful program called those Caminos that houses kids from Larchmont and the town of Mamaroneck, because it's the only program that is in the the one school elementary school district, one elementary school, and then the remaining school district that houses the majority of Hispanic kids. But all kids can attend that program. So you have that issue, which I understand why mass is overcrowding. Then you have, you know, if Hunter tier does go at the proposal up, it's not guaranteed to say that there are going to be all those kids are going to be in elementary or all those kids are going to be middle. All those kids are going to be in high school. You don't know. And then based upon the data that our our former plan, that the data he showed is that out of all the developments that have come up in the past decade or so. Well, and currently 12 kids are in our school district, 12 for rentals. Right? Yeah. So so then and then if you get down to parking, the possibility of if we do develop apartment 100, here's the money that we can get can be there could be we can build another parking structure because we do understand that parking is a serious issue. It's a serious issue because we have revitalized our downtown. Our downtown is like it's a nice spot that I hear from people. Even I work regionally. People in our region love to shop in our to go to restaurants. But couldn't you ask the developer to mitigate that problem by building some additional parking elsewhere? And we have elsewhere we haven't we haven't discussed that. But then this is also the problem. We have been stopped. We have been it's like this whole process has been has been kind of been pushed out. Like there's been such pushback that we haven't been able to have a decent conversation. Right. So it's just mired down. Well, Leilani, then that comes back to what we were talking about a minute ago. Why is that? At some point, the the good folks of Mamaroneck voted for Lou in Leilani, and I gather there's another board member, Manny, who's in favor of at least entertaining some kind of affordable housing proposal. There are affordable housing advocates, supporters, allies in that community that want to do something about this really significant social problem that exists in Mamaroneck and a lot of other places. Mm hmm. You got to be able to get to second base with it. If this is this is too much. This is too much. If if the thing dies before it even gets the first base because of a vocal group of people that don't really have a root in a a fully rationalized argument, although you're acknowledging parking, you're acknowledging the schools have to be addressed and so on and so forth. But those issues can all be addressed if there is a common belief that this is a social problem that needs to be addressed because we here are we're here alone. There isn't. There isn't. You know, the federal government's not going to solve this problem for Mamaroneck. The federal government or the state government is not going to send, you know, state troopers down here to force you to build affordable housing. It's got to come from Mamaroneck. And and that's appealing to that point. I'm sorry, even to that point, like you said, the state troopers are not even going to come down here and help and tell us how to fix our flooding because they can't even get their lives together. They but we we also and this is something I said at the last meeting, I said we have to finally rip the Band-Aid off and we have to sit here and do make a decision, get the information, make a decision and keep it flowing. But we have been so stagnant for so long and you have a lot of things feeling and it's like now we now we see we have to pay for things and we have to get things done. And then it becomes, well, we don't have any money. Right. And you have sort of an indefinite loop of delays. It's things like real quick. State and feds are involved in this. There's a ton of money available for these projects. Right? That's what the what's what's going to build them State, federal money. That's where the money's going to come from. I can tell you that workforce housing is supported by New York State because I used to work for the agency that managed it. I worked for the New York State Department of Housing and Community Renewal. There's this now, a year ago, the the village board decided to head down this path toward affordable housing. We made that decision and we went there. If if a this board or a subsequent board were to reverse course in the face of this kind of opposition, we might very well find ourselves on the wrong end of a federal civil rights lawsuit. And Lou, here's my point. If the federal government is supportive with a funding stream and state and so forth, the will still has to be at the local level, because if it isn't, you wind up in federal court. That could take ten or more years to resolve still no affordable housing. So the will has got to happen down at the local level where you folks are brave enough to venture. Well, that's just part of the problem that we get that we allowed to to take hold here. You just opened the can. I know. I know. We're coming to the end of the discussion, Lou, but I just want to kind of leave it leave it hanging here. Did you just open the can of worms when you talk about the feds getting involved with the what does that mean, that the feds will get involved in the process of building or litigating against your opponents? No, no, no. What what what could and I don't know how it would happen, but what could happen is somebody and these are very large organizations, very well funded organizations that are that are that have begun this process. If we if we change course now with this tenor of opposition, they have to question will, why did you change? And is it an it does it does it rise to the level of a of a federal civil rights lawsuit? And and some people think it might. That is what happened years ago in Yonkers. And if that happens, folks, there will be enough to talk about to keep 914 wire going to the year 3000. So Leilani and Lou, I want to thank you both for coming on the program. Leilani is our read. And Lou Young, our village guys are read. Thank you. I apologize, Lila. No worries. These folks have run for office and they march into the village hall on a monthly basis, probably more often, and they make the case to move things forward in the village of Mamaroneck. So thank you for coming on the show and talking about it. And that's going to wrap it up. If you're watching here, please click the subscribe button so that you find out when there's new episodes. If you're listening to the podcast, click follow. And that way you'll find you'll get a little tickler when there's a new podcast episode. So on behalf of my colleagues are Dina Seward and Peter Moses. Thank you very much again for being our guests. Thank you for tuning in and we'll talk to you on the next episode of nine One for a Wire. Thank you. Bye bye. Thank you.